Passing of A Kenpo Senior Instructor

[KenpoGirl]

I know I am not the appropriate one to post this, but I just read it on Al Tracy's site.

"John McSweeney died of a heart attack - Tuesday Feb 26, 2002. John was known as the Father of Irish Karate. John McSweeney was one of the few who studied directly with GrandMaster Ed Parker at the original studio in Pasadena in the late 50's and early 60's."

I figured you'd want to know.

I could not find contact to send your condolances. Perhaps someone could post it if they know.

My thoughts and prayers go out to his family.


:asian:

[GouRonin]

Al Tracy isn't always accurate.

[KenpoGirl]

It's posted right on his front page.

If I'm wrong I happily appologise.

http://www.tracyskarate.com/

Dot

[Bob Hubbard]

I did a quick check of a few locations I usually find news like this, and no luck on a confirmation. Keep in mind though, this may be too new to have spread far yet. I'll try and keep my eyes open for confirmation.

:asian:

[Klondike93]

What is this with all our kenpo seniors dieing of heart attacks?
Are they broken hearts from all the in fighting, or are they putting so much of their heart into it, it just couldn't take any more?

With condolences

Chuck

:(

[Sanxiawuyi]

Originally posted by KenpoGirl
"John McSweeney died of a heart attack - Tuesday Feb 26, 2002. John was known as the Father of Irish Karate. John McSweeney was one of the few who studied directly with GrandMaster Ed Parker at the original studio in Pasadena in the late 50's and early 60's."

My prayers are with the family and students of Mr. Mc Sweeney.

Sanxiawuyi (http://www.freewebz.com/kenpoexchange/)
:asian:

[Zoran]

On Tuesday February 26, 2002 at 2:00 pm, Grand Master John McSweeney, at the age of 74, passed away from a massive heart attack. This happened at his home in Fort Meyers Florida. His wife, Mary Ann, called 911 and he was rushed to the hospital. The doctors could not help him.

Mr. McSweeney began his training in the martial arts while very young in boxing. In 1952, while serving a tour in the U.S. Army, he was stationed in Japan where he trained in Kodokan Judo. In 1959, Mr. McSweeney met Mr. Ed Parker. In late 1962, Mr. Parker awarded him a black belt. That same year, Mr. McSweeney left for Dublin Ireland and opened Ireland's first Kenpo school. When he left Ireland, he left behind 4 black belts to carry on the legacy. Mr. McSweeney came to New York and opened a Kenpo school. Mr. McSweeney did not make a living on martial arts. So, sooner or later Mr. McSweeney left New York because of his job. When he left, he left behind 3 black belts, one of which was Frank DeMaria. In 1980 Mr. McSweeney opened a school in Elmhurst, Il. His first black belts there were, Tom Saviano, Ray Korda, and Mike Vassolo.
The short bio I just gave you, really does not do the man justice. I could tell you about his three rounds of service in three branches of the military. Or being the father of Kenpo in Ireland. Or the many organizations that honored him and practically threw certificates of rank at him. Or the many battles he had to face as was almost common place back in those days. None of that mattered to him. So, let me tell you about the man. John McSweeney's drive was the love of the for Martial Arts and the people in it. He was always a true gentleman. He was a man that always gave respect first and expected to receive it in return. He never looked down at anyone, no matter what their experience and rank was. He also never looked up to anyone, preferring to be eye to eye. He was comfortable being a teacher or a student, and continued to learn to the very end. If you had the great honor of Mr. McSweeney calling you a friend, you came away feeling that it meant something. And, he was much more than my limited writing ability could express.

Mr. McSweeney would always tell me to call him John. I compromised and agreed to call him John only in private. I will break this rule only this one time. John, you will be missed by myself and all the others you have touched. May God bless you soul.

For information call Tom Saviano at (630)495-1711

Zoran Sevic

[Dave Simmons]

This is directed at Gou...

You are such a doubting Gou at times. Although I can understand your hesitation regarding the death of SGM McSweeney. Was it last year somebody indicated Jim Tracy died without check it out?

Yeah, Al Tracy is opinated but inaccurate, no.

Peace,

Dave Simmons:D

[Goldendragon7]

I only met him a couple of times but it truly is sad to see another of ours go, regardless of wether or not you agree with all he did!

May he rest in Peace...:asian:

[Bob Hubbard]

Guys,
Please don't stray to the Parker/Tracy stuff here...Keep it focused on Grand Master John McSweeney.

Thank you.


RIP GM.:asian:

[GouRonin]

Originally posted by Dave Simmons
This is directed at Gou...
You are such a doubting Gou at times. Although I can understand your hesitation regarding the death of SGM McSweeney. Was it last year somebody indicated Jim Tracy died without check it out?
Yeah, Al Tracy is opinated but inaccurate, no.

Exactly. Some one, I don't know who last year tried to say that Jim Tracy died. I believe my response was, "Are you sure?"

Of course I am a "doubting Gou". Anyone who has knowledge of my past will see why.

As for Al Tracy being innaccurate, well, I don't know the guy but I have not heard a lot of positive stuff regarding him and what he's said. But then again, I wasn't there back in the day so I won't comment on what I don't know. I just want to point out that one website does not make the truth on anything. So if a guy Like McSweeny, (R.I.P.) ends up being told he's gone and isn't it can cause a lot of harm. Although I wasn't aware he was a SGM. Did he start his own Kenpo system? I'm not too knowledgable on his art.

One more thing, I still want to hear Al Tracy's version of Wil Tracy's sex cult and I know you do too! Heh heh heh...

But in a more serious manner, I know Zoran was a big supporter of McSweeny and I hope he is doing ok as well as all the other people who followed this man.

[Dave Simmons]

Hell the man was told , study Kenpo Karate from SGM Parker! He was totally into Kenpo. He always honored SGM Parker he had his permission to spread the Kenpo word. And just like most Kenpoist he personalized it. Over the years the end result produced the K.I.S.S. principle within his organization. He was a pioneer for Kenpo in Ireland, the East Coast USA and anywhere he lived.

His Kenpo principles I totally agreed with...power and speed based. If your attacked drop the attacker fast if you are knocked down get up don't stay on the ground stand up and strike.

As far as Al Tracy is concerned well McSweeney shared with me a nice little story. From time to time Ed Parker Studio in San Francisco would be visited by people who would challenge Parker. One particular night a Savate practitioner challenged Parker. Well, according to McSweeney, Parker said to Al Tracy it's your turn...The Savate guy squared off with Al Tracy . The Savate guy threw a front (wheel) roundhouse kick to Al's head Al met it with an inward block and broke the guys leg.

Lastly, you mentioned not hearing a lot of positive things about AL Tracy well I always consider the source(s). If it came from Parkers 1st generation (late 50's) that has merit. Anything later than that is not clear cut.

Just my opinion Gou also, the judo period with Parker (according to his real old students) he didn't like doing breakfalls and rolling. He preference later would be a "striker".

Peace,

Dave Simmons

:)

[Klondike93]

Originally posted by Dave Simmons
As far as Al Tracy is concerned well McSweeney shared with me a nice little story. From time to time Ed Parker Studio in San Francisco would be visited by people who would challenge Parker. One particular night a Savate practitioner challenged Parker. Well, according to McSweeney, Parker said to Al Tracy it's your turn...The Savate guy squared off with Al Tracy . The Savate guy threw a front (wheel) roundhouse kick to Al's head Al met it with an inward block and broke the guys leg.


Cool!! The basics in action.

But, I still haven't seen any posting as to why there was/is such a problem between the Tracy's and Mr. Parker. Anyone?

Chuck

:asian:

[Dave Simmons]

Hi Chuck,

I will put this response in very simple terms. Parker experienced a number set backs in the 60's. The last major one was with the Tracy's (Al & Jim) Will was not a factor. Basically the Tracy Brothers wanted to modernize the way students were taught(private & groups) with the help of Tom Connors etc. Parker had lost in previous years a number of his top Black Belts to Jimmy Wing Woo. This exodus was due to a disagreement over what was to be included in Secrets of Chinese Karate. The two parted ways, however many higher ranked Parker students were receiving lesson from Woo. When he left they left...

SGM Parker didn't necessarily disagree with the Tracy's innovation. The issue was involved, who had permission, who would run it etc. etc. I overheard a couple of "heated" discussions between Parker and Al Tracy. It definitely was a power struggle!

For what its worth, I never heard Al bad mouth his instructor, SGM Parker. In fact, many of us joined the IKKA, we did the Kenpo creed at every workout. We were then and today proud of our lineage to SGM Parker.

Hope this helps,

Dave Simmons

[Klondike93]

Yes it does, thanks for the info. I think it's cool that Al doesn't try to disassociate from Mr. Parker.

:asian:

Chuck

[Goldendragon7]

Well, thats not entirely true. Al Tracy "HAS" tried to distance himself and tried to develop what he terms HIS OWN ART, but the fact remains if you study the material it is unquestionably Parker in origin. He really had no choice but to acknowledge Ed Parker as his teacher, there were too many people that know the truth. Many bad things have been said in the past.

The good news is ...... it's the past and most realize what happened and are trying to move on in spite of any misunderstandings, bad feelings, lies, etc. Most just want to learn and improve their arts (whatever they call them today).

Ed Parkers legacy and techincal material will live forever on its own merit but Al Tracy certainly had a huge part in the "spread" of the Art and should be credited with that "major" roll, without him the art of American Kenpo would certainly be much much smaller than it is today.

:asian:

[KenpoGirl]

But shouldn't you be discussing this in another thread.

This IS a thread about a respected kenpoist passing away.
Politics should be discussed elsewhere

But that's just my opinion

Dot

P.S. If you see this same post elsewhere, it's because I was in a different thread and thinking about this one. D'oh :shrug: My bad

[Klondike93]

I think it's from a posting about how he got the SGM tag, which I don't think was ever answered.

:asian:

Chuck

[arnisador]

Originally posted by Klondike93

I think it's from a posting about how he got the SGM tag, which I don't think was ever answered.

I actually read it as Sergeant Major the first time.

[Zoran]

Originally posted by arnisador



I actually read it as Sergeant Major the first time.

I think he would have liked that. Senior Grand Master was a title other people gave to him. He was never refered to as SGM within our/his association. He was usually referred as GM McSweeney or Mr. McSweeney. He preferred being called John.

[Goldendragon7]

I thought the SGM comment was aimed at Ed Parker not McSweeney...... did I miss something?

:confused:

[Zoran]

Originally posted by Goldendragon7

I thought the SGM comment was aimed at Ed Parker not McSweeney...... did I miss something?

:confused:

:idunno:
I don't know, maybe I missed something. I assumed he meant this thread where someone referred to him as SGM McSweeney.

[Goldendragon7]

I dunno either lol
:idunno:

[tunetigress]

Originally posted by Klondike93



Cool!! The basics in action.

But, I still haven't seen any posting as to why there was/is such a problem between the Tracy's and Mr. Parker. Anyone?

Chuck

:asian:


From what I can see the problems are more a result of present day bravado, not necessarily a personal thing between Mr. Tracy and Mr. Parker, both of whom have made incredible contributions to the Art. Respectfully, _(_)_ Tune

[Rob_Broad]

It is sad to see another person who helped shape our art pass on. He will be greatly missed.

[Bob Hubbard]

Could someone please put a write up on this in the Memorials forum? Maybe add in some links to information on his life and contributions to the arts?

http://www.martialtalk.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=51

I've looked at this thread a few times, and can't really see any clean way to pull the politics from the memories. Perhaps a clean tribute would be best?

:asian:

[Rob_Broad]

Kaith, you should know by now that is how the kenpo community remebers each other is thru their political viewpoints.

Although a nicely written memorial would be nice.

[Goldendragon7]

Is this a new section......? If so, great idea!!:asian:

[Rob_Broad]

The link Kaith gave has been around for a while, and it has someinteresting stuff in it.

http://www.martialtalk.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=51

[Bob Hubbard]

Thank you. Its one of those, "Hope it doesn't see many new threads" things, as each new thread means we've lost someone.

But please, add thoughts and memories there on all the past masters.

:asian:

[Goldendragon7]

I don't want to read about anyone I know for a long time.
:asian:

[Dave Simmons]

I just learned about an interview back in September with SGM John McSweeney.

check www.kungfu.org It's long but informative...

Regards,

Dave Simmons

[Dave Simmons]

In the shadow of SGM John McSweeney passing. A number of Kenpo folks in the Chicago and surrounding area are encouraged to join us this Saturday at White Tiger Kenpo, Senior Instructor Tom Savianno dojo and student of McSweeney will host a small workout.

If you are able to attend please e-mail ASAP! Space is limited. The location is: White Tiger Kenpo 823 S. Route 53 Addison, IL phone (630)495-1711. Time: 4pm.

Peace,

Dave Simmons
:asian:

[Goldendragon7]

In Spirit I guess! :asian:

[Dave Simmons]

Yeah, I know what you mean. Dan Farmer cannot attend either. In previous conversations you and I have had...these "get togethers" have to start some place. Although the Chicago meeting will be modest. It is a start! Hopefully other areas of the country will do the same. These get togethers will help foster more understand between all Kenpo practitioners. Just my opinion!

Peace,

Dave Simmons :cool:

[Kirk]

I agree. I know something like this is a heck of an undertaking,
both financially, and with one's personal time. But they can
sure propogate into something really cool, and fortunate to all
involved. There are traditional gatherings that started long ago
and I'm assuming that the word about them was passed via
word of mouth, or mail outs. Whenever I was involved in
organizations in the past (non m.a. related) a lot of people
would BEG for a mail out, and the end result was that some got
them, and some didn't, and each year, the same story would
apply.


We're all in a new situation now. Relationships with people
you've never met are happening quite frequently on mediums
such as this, chat rooms, and web pages. Collectively, it's
a strong wealth of knowledge. If I were ever able to put
together a meeting, camp out, all crash at my place, whatever
with just the new "cyber friends" that I've met online:
1) it'd be some SERIOUS fun
2) I and my friends at the school whereI train would gain a HUGE
WEALTH of knowledge in a short time
3) Wouldn't make a dime off of it. ... it'd be in the name of learning
and fellowship.
If such an event were scheduled at a specific time every year,
the event would just grow and grow. Course I'm talking all
theory here, but that's what I'd like to think

[Goldendragon7]

I hear the terms "wealth of knowledge" but many want it for nothing.

Some must understand that for many of us, this is our livelihood ~ and to be asked to give away the only thing we have (our knowledge and advice) is like asking the grocer to have a free food bizarre so we can enjoy the friendship of the event.

Now I am all for the realistic sharing of Kenpo knowledge but leave off the emphasis "free". If I choose to teach for free then its my choice but I don't want to be expected to "give" my house and children's future away. I need to eat also.

I think if you read this forum or others that I have posted on ...... I feel that I have personally been more than generous with material and such. I know I can't speak for others and I won't, but that's how I feel.

Be realistic and fair.

:asian:

[Kirk]

I hear the terms "wealth of knowledge" but many want it for nothing.

Some must understand that for many of us, this is our livelihood ~ and to be asked to give away the only thing we have (our knowledge and advice) is like asking the grocer to have a free food bizarre so we can enjoy the friendship of the event.


I expect to get paid for my time, and can certainly understand
that you expect to get paid for yours. Yet for myself, I have
a lot to learn, and for others, they have a lot to gain by teaching.
A 1st degree b.b. gifted at teaching yet not a proffesional martial
artist would be a wealth of knowledge to me at this point. Hell,
I'd be happy to hang out with a bunch of orange belts that
would want to kick it for a few hours at a time, working on
techniques, forms, whatever.



Now I am all for the realistic sharing of Kenpo knowledge but leave off the emphasis "free". If I choose to teach for free then its my choice but I don't want to be expected to "give" my house and children's future away. I need to eat also.


That you do. I've heard about your teachings and passion for
it from many others. But you don't come cheap, either. (again
not saying that you're not worth 150% of it). But my point in
my previous post was that organizing a "get together" or
"event" and bringing in men of your stature costs money. If you
start off small, then in a short amount of time, what started off
as a group of kenpoists that are friends ranging in belt levels
getting together to party, workout, discuss and drown ourselves
in kenpo for a few days, can grow into an annual event. Could
potentially be a national event where we could bring in all the
"top dogs" of EPAK. I know that's pipe dreaming, but that
doesn't mean it's impossible.


As it stands right now, I'm sure there's a seminar, weekend
convention or campout, etc, where I can pay a reasonable
amount and steal quite a bit of knowledge from you. I sooo
look forward to attending these events in my kenpo journey.

There's some less well known high ranking martial artists that
might enjoy "hanging with the guys" cooking over a fire, drinking
some brews and kickin' the hell out of each other. :D
I'm a computer professional by trade. There's been quite a
few guys at my kenpo school that ask me for help with their
home PC's. A couple times they've asked me over to help them.
We workout a little, they offer me something to eat, and I fix
whatever's wrong with their computer. I'm not Bill Gates, Steve
Wozniak, or a pioneer in computers. I'm glad to help these
guys with what I know. So maybe offering a fun weekend to
a 3rd, 4th degree b.b. could result in something similar???

I think I'm being redundant now. I'm not always confident in
my ability to relate what's going on in my head, so sometimes
I'll try to make my point more than once :(



I think if you read this forum or others that I have posted on ...... I feel that I have personally been more than generous with material and such. I know I can't speak for others and I won't, but that's how I feel.


I couldn't agree more! I sure hope that you don't feel that the
gift you give on these forums are being taken for granted!
It's certainly not by me, please believe that!



Be realistic and fair.


I guess it is just a b.s. fantasy, but I still think there's some
validity there. As for fair .. I hope I didn't sound demeaning
or insulting in any way, it was definitely not my intention, sir.


:asian:

[Goldendragon7]

Nice post Kirk and a good reflection of your feelings. I do disagree with one area.........

To quote Kirk.......
"I've heard about your teachings and passion for it from many others. But you don't come cheap, either. (again not saying that you're not worth 150% of it)"

I don't know who you have talked to but my fees are well below any of the others of Similar or lesser knowledge. That's my problem. I'm too easy. I don't like to be cheated or lied to, that I will say, those that have, know well how I feel and will never have a 2nd opportunity (I have a good and long memory) but I have learned not to put myself in bad situations.

As to the passion on Kenpo, well I can't control myself. If you get me started ..... it's hard to slow me down. I Love it, and if fueled by a serious group, get way too excited about the Art, I have done 8 + hour seminars (when it was a scheduled 1 1/2 hour workshop). lol

Mr. Parker always taught me .... "leave them more than satisfied but hungry".
:asian:

[Kirk]

Well then .. what are your rates? I don't control who my
instructor decides to host, but he told me he's open to
requests. I can pass on the info to him, and beg him to
bring you in. :D

If you don't want to discuss that openly, you can email me
at kirknchristy@sbcglobal.net . Have you ever been to
the Alamo? It's highly over rated, but you'll at least be able
to say ya been there. :rofl:

[Goldendragon7]

Yes, I come to San Antonio about once or twice a year. Neat place. I love the riverwalk. So many things to see there you never run out of stuff to see.

:asian:

[Kirk]

Curtis Abernathy. The school is American Kenpo Karate.

If this isn't where you go, then I'm assuming you go to
Mr Castro's studio?

[Goldendragon7]

Brian Duffy in Austin has a camp in October every year outside of San Antonio (Bob White, Frank Trejo, Tom Kelly, John Sepulveda, Steve LaBounty and myself are all perennials).

I was in contact with Mr. Abernathy last year and he seemed interested in having a seminar at that time. Put another bug in his ear and see if this year is better for him.

It would be fun to see you.
:)

[Kirk]

Oh, okay! I'd heard of that one. Mr Abernathy said that he was
informed of it like a week before it happened, so no one at my
school could make it. A lot of us are looking forward to it this
year.

[Goldendragon7]

October 11, 12 & 13th this year....... so mark your callendar...
For more info ........

http://www.akfkenpo.com/camp/

be there.....

:asian:

[kenpo3631]

Originally posted by Dave Simmons




For what its worth, I never heard Al bad mouth his instructor, SGM Parker. In fact, many of us joined the IKKA, we did the Kenpo creed at every workout. We were then and today proud of our lineage to SGM Parker.

Hope this helps,

Dave Simmons

Mr. Simmons,

I will have to disagree with you on this point. I have on video Al Tracey "bashing" Mr. Parker. Pretty bad I must say. The proof is in the pudding.

The tape is from a seminar in Massachusetts at a Tracy school none the less.:asian:

[Dave Simmons]

It went both ways at time I am sure. My point is Al Tracy did not badmouth SGM Parker around me or his other first generation Tracy students.

If you have the video I would like to have a copy!

Peace,

Dave Simmons

[Kirk]

Originally posted by Dave Simmons
If you have the video I would like to have a copy!
[/B]

You should put it in digital format, if you have the means.
It'd be good for future reference, as this debate seems to
pop it's head out on every kenpo forum. I'm sure if ya
gave it out, it'd end up on web pages all over the net.

[Goldendragon7]

What seminar was that..... where?:confused: