Grappling

[Nightingale]

How many women who train in grappling find that the men are uncomfortable training with them. I've heard a few comments like "its weird to grapple with the girls... I'm always afraid of putting my hands in the wrong place..." how common is this?

[Eraser]

Night,

To tell ya the truth... me being woman.. i find it more awkward to grapple with another woman... i'd rather grapple with the guys.. cuz in reality... its gonna be a man (and you wouldn't want to be him) that i may have to deal with if that situation ever presents its self.... I can only hope not!!!
:asian:

[MountainSage]

I have never had to wrestle a girl/women,other than my wife(different motive), in my life. I would make me uncomfortable in a friendly competition, not in a fight situation. In a friendly comp I'd be nervous about grabbing the improper piece of anatomy. I was taught to be a gentleman at all time, except when the women hit first in anger.

Mountainsage

[KenpoTess]

At our school we also train in Samurai Jiu-jitsu and there's not always an even number of females to males for grappling partners. The people who've been training together for a few years have no problem whatsoever grappling other sex. The new students on the other hand , either sex, seem to have issues.
When I spar Randy we , 99% of the time end up grappling, which in reality is most likely how an encounter would end up. He had me down last Tuesday, flipped me over on my stomach, *Turtle* not a place we want to be, He's bigger and stronger than I, so I did what comes naturally, I bit him and he released me quick smart :)
I enjoy grappling, and doesn't matter male or female, though one of the guys has issues with thinking he will hurt me.. but guess he's gonna always have issues with that.. I have no fear of him .. :)
Tess

[Chronuss]

Originally posted by KenpoTess
I have no fear of him .. :) Tess

....:D

[LadyDragon]

I'm not particular as to whom I train with. Whether it be man or woman makes no difference to me. My mission is to be the one still alive at the end of that particular training session. (not that I always am) And I've never had any problems in training with the guys at my school. And I don't think that any of them have had problems training with me. But of course its defferent for everyone.

[MartialArtsChic]

I like grappling with the guys. Gives me potential insight into what I can and can't do if it were ever needed in real life. I'm the only female so I think it helps for the newer guys to watch me have at it with the upper ranks. There really isn't any room for the "you're a girl" thing.

Besides, if they still feel weird about it when they grapple with me, I usually just nail their butts to the mat and they get over it real quick.

[Touch Of Death]

Originally posted by Eraser
Night,

To tell ya the truth... me being woman.. i find it more awkward to grapple with another woman... i'd rather grapple with the guys.. cuz in reality... its gonna be a man (and you wouldn't want to be him) that i may have to deal with if that situation ever presents its self.... I can only hope not!!!
:asian:
No, the reality is that you could just as easily be attacked by a woman. I know some violent women.

[OULobo]

I don't have a problem sparring women. My instructor used to use me to spar them, because I was the only one who would pound the hell out of them and still sleep well at night. Obviously this is when we were to told to open it up in practice. Now grappling is another story. I do get a little weirded out because grappling is such a "contact art". Even when you are not actively trying to apply a technique it is still contact (besides I would have trouble explaining what I am doing to my fiancee if someone took a picture of me applying my patented "cup-to-face grind") However I think if I had done it a few times I could quickly get over the ick factor of it. Lastly, I have to mention that the few times that I have grappled a woman, it was because they wanted to flirt and it just degraded into a gigglefest. I don't have time in training to be giggling, despite how much fun it was.

[7starmantis]

yes, giggle-fests can really interupt a class or training session. :D

7sm

[feintem]

Make sure for your sake and your partners sake you don't take the gound part lightly it is a bad place to be and freeze because you were to embarrassed to touch someone some place.






Michael

[KenpoTess]

when I'm on the ground with a guy, either from sparring and ending up in takedowns or from a playful takedown for the fun of it.. the last thing I think about is what anatomical part I'm grabbing.. or what part they may have grabbed.. there's absolutely nothing sexual in trying to pin or get out of a arm/leg bar etc.. I've reached behind me and tugged on what have you .. then leaned in and bit my opponents.. :D

[hardheadjarhead]

One of the women in the CSW class was a regular training partner. She'd actually roll too hard and I had to ask her to back off. She was very, very strong and wouldn't relax on the drills...everything was all out. This took a toll on me, as I was greater than double her age.

Was she uncomfortable with me? I was her instructor in another art for years, and we'd grown quite close. She looks at me as a father figure. I think she felt she had to prove something to me. Our communication was good, though, and I was able to ask her to back off a bit.

She learned to relax eventually. It made her a lot better, and saved me a lot of grief.

As far as the gender difference...not in this case. She was in California last summer, though, and a guy literally groped her during training. He got mounted, and placed his hands on her breasts and taunted her "What ya gonna do now?"

The pig.


Regards,

Steve Scott

[albert]

i don't like grappling with women. they should just make me steak dinners because realistically i'd just pound on them in real life.





kidding.

[Ceicei]

Originally posted by hardheadjarhead
...and a guy literally groped her during training. He got mounted, and placed his hands on her breasts and taunted her "What ya gonna do now?"
The pig.



Indeed. If he did that to me, what would I gonna do? I would have socked him a good one in the head. I would hope he would think twice...

I have no problem if it was ordinary grappling, but such blatant touching like he did, I would definitely make it clear to him I won't play that game.

You didn't say how your friend dealt with him.

- Ceicei
- Ceicei

[Rich Parsons]

Originally posted by Nightingale
How many women who train in grappling find that the men are uncomfortable training with them. I've heard a few comments like "its weird to grapple with the girls... I'm always afraid of putting my hands in the wrong place..." how common is this?

Good Question Nightingale!

I have no problems wrestling or grappling with anyone.

Although, I remember a young lady in our class or about 20, and she had no problems sparring or ground fighting, until someone asked if the postitions had names, I then described and demonstrated the Guard and Mount positions. She then turned to me and Said, " I am not going to mount him!" :eek:

So, we did not do any grappling or ground fighting for a while. Just let it happen a few weeks later and no one had a problem after that.


On a side note, while I was bouncing there was a young lady who would kick guys in the shins and feet for fun. She caught me, once, and I Asked her not to do it again. I also told her one day someone was going to hurt her back. Well later she tried it again. I just reached out and grabbed/cupped her head wiht my right hand and placed her ever so gently on the ground. She was surprised and not sure what was going to happen. I just picked her back up and told her that the next guy may not be so nice.

The point I am trying to make is that even if you do not conentrate on this area, it is good to do it once in a while so as to not totally feel uncomfortable in this area of operations.

A female friend of mine a couple of years ago, is in the Naval Reserve and she enjoyed the grappling and ground fighting. She had no extensive training, yet it was a good cardio and she did learn that even with the size difference it was not over just because she was on the ground with a larger male.

:asian:

[hardheadjarhead]

Ceicei...

She cursed him out rather violently.

I don't think she did enough...she should have also reported it to the instructor and the manager of the school.

I told her this...but again, she looks treats me like a parent...and she just let it go through one ear and out the other.

Steve Scott

[tshadowchaser]

she should have kicked him between the legs as soon as she should up

[hardheadjarhead]

I suppose so...I guess each of us could fantasize about what we think we'd do or what she should have done.

What she does the next time...that's what concerns me the most.

SCS

[Ceicei]

Originally posted by hardheadjarhead

What she does the next time...that's what concerns me the most.


Are you worried about a passive response from her? If you've been training with her as long as you have, wouldn't she respond more physically the next time?

I would hope she would, because the next time a guy does this to her, he might not have backed off like the first one did.

- Ceicei

[hardheadjarhead]

No, Ceicei, I'm confident she can handle herself in a self defense situation.

In this public situation I think she should have reported the guy to the instructors and managers of the school. The instructor didn't see it, and she didn't tell him. I don't think she considered the consequences of not telling him. The guy, no doubt, will humiliate other women in this fashion. I suspect he'll eventually get called on it...but she had an opportunity to get him hammered right there.

The young lady in question doesn't often listen to the experience of others. She is so intent on being independent that she shuts down when people try to give her the benefit of their experience.

She is learning, though, that this is not the best tactic in life. My son is going through the same process with me. He is, interestingly, now asking questions about certain life skills. Before he had that adolescent "I don't need anybody to tell ME how to do it!"

Regards,

Steve

[Ceicei]

Originally posted by hardheadjarhead
She is learning, though, that this is not the best tactic in life.

My son is going through the same process with me. He is, interestingly, now asking questions about certain life skills. Before he had that adolescent "I don't need anybody to tell ME how to do it!"



I hope she learns quickly that there is benefit in taking lessons from other's experiences.

Just out of curiosity, how old is your son? Is he into martial arts too?

Maybe there is hope yet... My oldest son is 11 and he hasn't got to that rebellious stage, though there were moments of fiery display.

This could easily turn into another good thread about what to do with youth who have difficulty listening or taking instructions/advice.

- Ceicei

[hardheadjarhead]

Ceicei,

A little OT, but I'll get right back to it...

My son isn't my biological offspring. We first met him when he was 11. He was given a scholarship to our school and worked his way up to black belt with us.

When he was 15 he moved in with us. His mother had died and his dad was an abusive drug addict. The courts awarded us custody and guardianship. His father is now dead. Our family has accepted him. My nieces and nephews call him "cousin". He was listed in Grandma's obit as a surviving great grandchild.

He is now 20 and a junior at Purdue...and I think doing well. We'll see how his grades are this semester.

------------------------------------------------------------------

To turn this back to the topic of the thread...when Patrick (my boy) was coming up through the ranks he fought the young lady we've talked about in this thread. NONE of the males in his peer group expressed anything but respect for the this woman and her sister insofar as their fighting ability.

I found out just today that we have a couple of teenage boys in our Jun Fan class dissing the women Muay Thai kickboxers. They're being outrageously snotty and disrespectful, from what I've heard...making sexist comments and mocking them when they're hitting the pads.

I am leaving it in the hands of the immediate Jun Fan instructor. I've directed the woman we've been talking about (who is also one of several women being dissed) to also deal with it. She's a black belt too...and given what we've talked about, I WANT her to deal with it.

I'll step in last, and only if necessary. I believe in what we used to call in the Marines as a "chain of command". I prefer my black belts to handle these things. They never learn leadership otherwise.

A part of me wants to jump right on those two punks, though. I'd love nothing better than to give them an old fashion a** chewing. I'll restrain myself. My leaders have to lead. If they don't, then four people will be called on the carpet. Suffice to say this issue will be resolved to my satisfaction and to the satisfaction of the women in question.


Regards,

Steve

[triwahine]

After reading a good number of these posts, I forgot the meaning behind it. I can say that I wish I had more time to grapple. We spend so much time on fundamentals and techniques that this portion is missing. I'll grapple with whomever. Would I be embarassed to grab somewhere? No. It''s part of training and one has to learn the skills. I also take judo and there are three in the class: 2 men and me. I go up against both of them. I think they are more concerned with hurting me than touching where they shouldn't. We go at it and I'm learning. So, with that said, I hope that for 2004 more grappling will be added to my regular training.

B

:samurai:

[bob919]

women like to use me to play the attacker when their practicing their womens self defense i think its cause i'm strong but i dont hurt them

their is no problem grappling with women i mean they ca touch me just easily as i can touch them but it doesn;t matter id we do.

they have actually gotten really good and once or twice have got me in a hold i cant get out of.

its just not funny when a 100lb woman has a 240lb man trapped on the floor

[Ceicei]

Originally posted by bob919
they have actually gotten really good and once or twice have got me in a hold i cant get out of.

its just not funny when a 100lb woman has a 240lb man trapped on the floor

Now THAT would be interesting to watch... Definitely a handy skill for a woman to have.

- Ceicei

[eric]

We have women come in from time to time at our Brazilian Jiu Jitsu school. Nobody has a problem with it. I sometimes get a bit hesitant at putting a lot of pressure on a smaller woman - but this is my hang-up. It's my male conditioning in this behavior. We are all there to help each other - being a good training partner - so that we can all get the most out of it. If I don't treat a woman the same as a man then I'm holding back and that's not helpful to her. Actually I have found the women I roll with have been more technically proficient at the art since they can't rely on strength. If you want the best training and a great environment, check out www.saundersbjj.com.