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Thread: Modern Arnis Lineage List or chart

  1. #1
    Bob Guest

    Modern Arnis Lineage List or chart

    Cut and Pasted from the WMAC forum
    Hello Modern Arnis Clan,

    No doubt, good, bad, and indifferent, we are just that a very large worldwide group of Modern Arnis practitioners.

    I have been assigned the task by a major Martial Arts Publication to compile a list of all the senior students of Professor Presas and form a chart of sorts as to lineage in the system.

    This will be a non political attempt to share this information with readers worldwide and establish some form of order and progression as to who has been a part of the art and for how long.

    I will also ask for assistance from key people to research the worldwide web search engine for names connected with Modern Arnis and try to include as many practitioners as possible.

    Criteria will include Name, Rank, date received, Country, time in the art, certification directly from Remy A. Presas, and a minimum of a 3rd degree black belt grading. This may have to be changed to 4th or even 5th degree depending on the size of the list.

    No major statements will be listed with each name, if you have people in mind and would like to include this information for status of position and recognition for inclusion it may help in deciding who will be listed but it is not a who has done what article only a listing of potential lineage practitioners to be included in the article or chart.

    This is a big request, especially to keep non political, but like I said it is for a Major Publication and only a certain amount of time will be allowed to voice your contribution and list those you feel stand within the perimeter mentioned.

    I will confirm information with other instructors who may not even like or respect each other but I think it is important enough to open the door for all to be listed who have contributed support to Modern Arnis and Professor Presas.

    To some degree individuals such as Bruce Jutnick and Rick Alemedy could be included(many are historical references) but for the most part "recognized active involvement" in the art of Modern Arnis should be a part of the criteria.

    If an individual has passed away he could be included as well if his contribution to the art is valid, he will be listed as deceased but part of the seniority lineage.

    This opportunity may never come again so speak now or forever complain!

    You may list the names here, or e-mail directly to kellyworden@attbi.com

    Thank you for your input...

    Kelly S. Worden
    _________________

  2. #2
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    Good luck with that one!
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  3. #3
    Bob Guest
    Taken from the WMAC forum
    In general here are some names from the tribe in no specific order:
    Terry Wareham-Colorado 3rd.degree
    Tony Silverio-Conn. 4th degree started 1985
    Willie Annung-Philippines (Deceased)
    Randi Shea-Texas 5th degree
    Rodillio Dagooc-Philippines 8th degree started 1969
    Vicente Sanchez-Philippines 8th degree started 1970
    Jay Spiro- Detroit 4th degree started 1986
    Micheal Donovan-Ontario 4th degree
    Jim Ladis- Chicago 5th degree started-1989
    Shishir Inocalla-Canada-Philippines Datu
    Chuck Gauss-Michigan 5 th degree started 1989
    Bob Quinn-Atlanta 5th degree
    Roland Dantes-Austrailia-Philippines 8th degree
    Remy Presas Jr.- Philippines-California Punong Guru started 1969
    Demitrio Presas -Philippines-California Punong Guru
    Mary Ann Presas-Philippines-California Punong guru
    Roland Rivera-N. Carolina 3rd degree
    Dieter Knuttel-Germany "Datu" 6th degree
    Scott VanDerzee-Mich. 3rd degree started 1986
    Dan Carr-Buffalo 5th degree
    Ernesto Presas-Philippines Grandmaster Presas Style
    Roberto Presas-Philippines
    David Hoffman-Boston "Datu" 5th degree?
    Tim Hartman-N.Y. "Datu" 6th degree
    David Ng-N.Carolina 4th degree
    Richard Roy-Mass. 5th degree
    Brian Zawilinski-Conn. 5th degree 1985
    Ric Bong Sun Jornales-Michigan "Datu" 6th degree
    Dan McConnell-Ohio 3rd degree started 1992
    Lee Lowry 6th degree
    Murlino Hufano- Washington 4th degree
    Jerome Barber-Buffalo ?
    Micheal Bates-Phil. ?
    Ken Smith-Chicago 5th degree started 1990
    David Converse-Chicago 5th degree
    Bram Frank-Florida ?
    Jeremias de la Cruz-Philippines started 1970
    Joe Breidenstein-Phil. 4th degree
    Tom Bolden-N.Y. ?
    Al Garza-Texas 3rd degree started 1990
    Doug Pierre-N.Y. ?
    Gabriele Roloff-Germany 5th degree started 1984
    Mike Morton-Washington ?
    Jeff Delaney-Texas 5th degree started 1990
    Kelly Worden-Washington "Datu" 6th degree started 1982

    Additional names will be added as the information comes available, I want to thank those who bumped an e-mail and provided names. Further clarification on current status- active or inactive status may be included depending on space.
    Historical references might be added separately to the lineage chart for those who have come and gone if space permits.
    Just to reiterate a point of reference, a certain amount of research will be conducted to establish this Lineage Chart and clarify status in Modern Arnis. Those not willing to provide their information will be left out, this is history being colaborated, step up or step out!
    Thank You,
    Kelly S. Worden
    ________________

  4. #4
    arnisador is offline

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    Thanks, it's interesting to have this information.

  5. #5
    Bob Guest
    Arnisador
    Thanks for the support.
    Info taken from the WMAC Forum
    During conversations with different people about this project there seems to be two thoughts of validity. One is that only current people should be included, the other is that all people who acheived rank should be included and it should be broken down into generations. After consideration I think the most important direction would be to include all students that acheived at least Blackbelt rank to give a valid reflection of Professor's impact on the Industry.
    Due to the nature of Professor Presas' travels and different phases of the art, the lineage will be broken down into the following Generations.

    Generation 1 includes those involved in founding of Modern Arnis, this list is fairly complete now.

    Generation 2 includes those that were a part of the group during the NARAPHIL era.

    Generation 3 will be those involved with Professor when he arrived here in the U.S. early 70's.

    Generation 4 will be those involved from late 70's until his passing.

    All individuals will be concidered for inclusion, but ranking directly from Professor is required to be in the Lineage Chart.
    You may list the names here, or e-mail directly to kellyworden@attbi.com

    Thank you for your input...

    Here are more names submitted via e-mail:

    Lorenzo Presas - cousin of Remy
    Leonard Trigg-Oregon
    Barbara Bones
    Janesa Kruse
    Jeff Arnold
    Rocky Pawsik
    Jun Makanano
    Dean Stockwell
    Frank Scalercio
    Dr. Lengson
    Max Pallen
    Jose E. Bueno
    Fred King
    Herb Blue
    Dan Verdugo
    Fred Shadian
    Kelly Yuen
    Rick Alemany
    Bruce Juchnik

    Kelly S. Worden

  6. #6
    Bob Guest
    Info taken from the WMAC forum
    Hi Kelly,

    here are the my students, that received a Modern Arnis rank after a grading directly from the Professor. There are at least half a dozend more 3rd Dans, but they got the rank for example from the grading with Roland Dantes this year or from our German ranking commission, like Alfred Plath for example, who made 3rd Dan in 1991 already and of course some of my Scandinavian students.
    There are no other 4th or 5th Dans within the DAV. They are complete and examined by the Professor.

    The years of the beginning of the training are with some people approximate, could be wrong by one year.

    Anyway, were is the list of the German black belts from 3rd to 6th Dan.



    Name - rank/year of the rank - start of the Arnis training

    Datu Dieter Knüttel - 6th Dan/1996 - 1978

    Hans Karrer - 5 th Dan/1999 - 1979
    Jorgen Gydesen - 5 th Dan/1999 - 1983

    Peter Rutkowski - 4th Dan/1999 - 1984
    Carsten Hemmersbach - 4 th Dan/1999 - 1988

    Helmut Meisel - 3rd Dan/1996 - 1984
    Michael Jux - 3 rd Dan/1996 - 1982
    Simone Schlötels - 3 rd Dan/1996 - 1987
    Sunny Graff - 3 rd Dan/1999 - 1985
    Kall Wall - 3rd Dan/1999 - 1984
    Albert Diemer - 3rd Dan/1999 - 1984
    Sven Barchfeld - 3rd Dan/1999 - 1985
    Bernd Vieth - 3rd Dan/1999 - 1988
    Roland Schültke - 3rd Dan/1999 - 1991
    Siegfried Derwisch - 3rd Dan/1999 - 1985



    So much for that, good luck with your lineage. I am sure it is a lot of work.


    Best regards from Germany


    Dieter Knüttel
    Datu of Modenr Arnis
    _________________
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    ABANICO Video Productions
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  7. #7
    Bob Guest
    Info taken from WMAC forum
    From: <ModArnis@aol.com>
    To: <kellyworden@attbi.com>
    Subject: Lineage
    Date: Friday, November 22, 2002 3:54 AM

    Datu Worden,

    You might also include Janet Aalfs 4th from Massachussetts. She started in
    1981 when Lee Lowry did. I believe Doug Pierre is a 4th as well. Bob Quinn
    started about the same time. Bob, Tony Silverio and Brian Zawilinski all
    trained with Lee Lowry at that time.

    Brett Salafia
    Connecticut
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    THANKS FOR SENDING THE ADDRESS OF KERRY....THE EVENTS THAT HAPPENED
    BETWEEN GEN. VER AND REMY ARE TRUE AND I WAS A WITNESS TO THIS... I
    EVEN HAD TO PERSONNALY ACCOMPANY REMY TO BOARD HIS FLIGHT TO THE UNITED
    STATES TO HELP FACILITATE HIS MILITARY CLEARANCE AT THE TIME BECAUSE
    THE COUNTRY ( PHILIPPINES ) WAS IN A STATE OF MARTIAL LAW !
    WITH REGARDS TO DR. FRANK SCALERCIO...HE WAS INSTRUMENTAL IN ARRANGING
    SEMINARS FOR REMY IN THE EARLY 70'S ...PARTICULARLY WITH LAW ENFORCEMENT
    AGENCIES IN THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA...INCLUDING CORRECTIONAL OFFICERS
    AT THE FAMOUS SAN QUENTIN PRISON PENITENTIARY !....IN FACT FRANK SCALERCIO
    JUST CALLED ME UP THE OTHER DAY TO INFORM ME THAT HE IS ARRIVING IN THE PHILIPPINES NEXT WEEK
    SO I WILL BE MEETING UP WITH HIM SOON !
    WELL BROTHER...I WISH YOU ALL THE BEST IN ALL YOUR PROJECTS !
    CARRY ON BRO ...YOU'RE DOING GREAT !

    SINCERELY,
    ROLAND
    P.S. REGARDS TO EVERYONE !
    _________________
    Kelly S. Worden

  8. #8
    Bob Guest
    Info taken from the WMAC forum

    More Oregonians to the list
    Name - State - Black Belt Degree

    Tim Dawdy - Oregon - 1st
    Dinnelle Wright - Oregon - 1st
    Fred King - Oregon - 5th
    Tim Gustavson - Oregon - 1st
    Tyler Stone - Oregon - 1st
    Kevin Worden - Oregon - 1st
    Lynn Anderson - Oregon - 4th
    Charles Blodgett (deceased) - Oregon - 1st

    Dan Anderson

  9. #9
    Bob Guest
    Info taken from the WMAC forum
    Thank you Dan Anderson for some of the Oregon names, additionally I'm working on including all blackbelts to the list so if that is a good thing, please keep the names rolling in!

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Irwin Carmichael
    Rick Mitchell
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Sunny Graff und Bernd Vieth
    3rd Dan Modern Arnis
    Tested by Professor Remy Presas
    29. Oktober 1999
    Frankfurt Germany
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Hi Mr. Worden- I think you have your work cut out for you, but I am happy to help any way I can. I was a student of Remy from 1983 to 1985. I attended the first two summer camps in West Virginia and in Pennsylvania, and received my black belt directly from Remy.
    I still have the original lists of the people who actually attended those camps, so if you ever need to verify someone's claim, I can probably help, at least for that particular time period. One note though, I am working in Saudi Arabia right now and the lists are in storage in the US. I plan to be back next June/July, but couldn't get to them before then.
    Good luck with your effort. Take care. Steven C. Drape Chief Instructor, KBS System http://www.kbs-system.com
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Hello Kelly,
    In response to your post on eskrima digest. thanks,
    Guro Andrew "tattoo" Filardo started training under Professor Presas 1985 recieved advanced inst. certificate late 1986 from Professor, with Lee Lowery, Bowden Sween, Michael Morton, on board.

    4th degree black belt 1999
    Owner - M.F.A. academy, N.Y.Modern Arnisfull contact stickfightingboxing/kickboxing
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    _________________
    Kelly S. Worden
    I encourage everyone to share info. Martial talk has a large following of Modern Arnis people, so don't be shy. Either send a private email to Datu Worden or post on either Martial talk, or WMAC forum. This is an important project, so speak out or for ever hold your peace......
    Thanks in advance for any help you may give to this project....
    Bob

  10. #10
    Datu Tim Hartman's Avatar
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    Buffalo, NY

    Bob,
    I'll give the Buffalo, NY list the best I can.

    Jerome Barber 3rd
    Kevin Black 3rd
    Dan Carr ???
    Bob Chesbro 3rd
    Tim Hartman 6th
    Jeff Rech 3rd
    Don Zanghi ???


    In Buffalo we produced 33 Black Belts that had tested in front of Remy himself. The list above are the 3rd degrees and higher. If you need any help let me know. I worked on a simular project in the past.

    Respectfully yours,
    Tim Hartman
    Respectfully Yours,

    Datu Tim Hartman
    GM Presas Arnis
    World Modern Arnis Alliance
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    "Nearly all men can withstand failure... But if you want to test a man's character; give him power."

  11. #11
    Bob Guest
    Datu Hartman
    Thanks

    Bob

  12. #12
    Bob Guest

    Update

    1st quote Taken from the Escrima digest

    This is only part of the story. Please do your own research to find out the missing pieces. (Disclaimer: this post is not intended to start a flame war or a political battle. The argument between Datu Worden and Mr. Jay De Long was long before the "Lineage request" came up....)
    Mr. Worden,

    You wrote that Generation 2 includes those that were a part of the group
    during the NARAPHIL era.

    During our last e-mail exchange back in September, in reference to my Modern
    Arnis training via NARAPHIL, you took me (and NARAPHIL) to task and wrote
    "NARAPHIL was a direct insult to Remy Presas!"

    Could you please explain the seeming contradiction between your two
    statements? Has your recent review of NARAPHIL history revealed to you that
    there were many dedicated Modern Arnis practitioners in NARAPHIL loyal to
    the Presases who can claim legitimate Modern Arnis lineage?

    I would say that Generation 2 would be made up of hundreds of legitimate
    Modern Arnis practitioners, both Filipino and non-Filipino (I guess
    depending on how you define "senior student" and "ranking") And by the way,
    how can you personally ascertain who was a legitimate and loyal Generation 2
    Modern Arnis practitioner? Will you be plowing and poring over NARAPHIL
    records covering at least a dozen years in the Philippines?

    Mr. Worden, as a late rebuttal to your last e-mail, I would like to state
    unequivocably that I have no intention or desire to meddle in, influence or
    capitalize on Modern Arnis affairs, including your lineage chart. But I
    will express my opinions (solicited or otherwise, on any topic that
    interests me), just as hundreds have done and do in MA magazines, internet
    digests and forums, etc. Again, I feel privileged to have known and trained
    with Prof. Presas, and many outstanding Modern Arnis masters in the
    Philippines and U.S.

    Good luck with your project; that is a daunting task.

    Jay de Leon
    This quote taken from the WMAC forum....
    To reply to Jay de Leon or other interested and concerned individuals,

    This is a task I and others are doing as a favor to Inside Kung Fu Editor Dave Cater mainly to get an idea of what is happening with Modern Arnis. The request and project is to establish an outline as to who has been a part of Modern Arnis over the years and who is still actively involved.

    As mentioned in the outline or guidelines for inclusion there is a timeline on the submitting the results.
    Ideally, others will have concerns or care and submit names that they feel fit the criteria, simple as that. I will with the help of other knowledgeable people put them in order of when they participated in Modern Arnis, that is why the year they started is important.

    Weather I personally feel or others feel NARAPHIL or 2nd Generation practitioners had a riff or political issue with Professor is unimportant in this effort. Professor had more than one riff or conflict throughout his long martial arts career in the Philippines, U.S., Europe, or Worldwide for that matter.
    What martial arts group or leader has not experienced splintering?
    It is not my desire to address this issue nor my concern, only to establish the practitioners that choose to step forward and claim their spot in Modern Arnis history and lineage. The only key point here is being a part of lineage and history.
    Am I going to toil away for endless hours on this daunting task searching records throughout the world? NO!
    At the required deadline to submit a report I will do just that submit it! Will it have every name who ever trained with Professor on it?
    No, but I do know the chart will be more complete than it ever has in the past. Additionally, that effort Mr. de Leon will be more of an effort than has been offered in the past! If you or anyone else would like to submit names, dates, and ranks of people you know, please do. I am in contact with people in the Philippines, the U.S. and other countries who will remember almost any name that may be submitted.
    If by chance during this first effort names are not listed, obtained, or substantial acknowledgement of their status cannot be verified a second effort could be launched. Possibly at some time in the future when another publication or governing martial arts body requests the information additional attention may be directed to include a more complete directory of names and dates.
    This current effort is one I and others are attempting, if it appears to be lacking some of the credible people of the past, let them step forth and do the work themselves, simple as that!
    Like it says in the outline, "SPEAK NOW OR FOREVER COMPLAIN !"

    Records that were never kept may be lost forever, all that can be done today is to try,
    Sincerely, Kelly S. Worden

  13. #13
    Bob Guest
    Personal email posted on the WMAC forum
    Dear Mr. Worden:

    Recently a student e-mailed me some info from the Escrima Digest, re: you drumming up a list of Modern Arnis old-timers (or something to that effect). I am assuming that commo was/is for real. SO........

    I dragged out my old certificates. Got the Lakan/Basic Instructor parchment, dated August 6, 1983, signed by J. Arnold, M. Replogle, and Remy Presas. This from the West Virginia camp; I did two weeks back to back there, as did Irey Cobb (Oklahoma) and Mike Morton (KS and CO). On the second week Joe Breidenstein showed up--surely you've heard of him. He was the org secretary for some time back then. He also hosted a weeklong camp in Phily in 1985, where I retested for Lakan.

    I managed to catch up with Remy here and there for the next decade or so, and in 1993 (11 July) picked up Lakan Dalawa, at Terry Wareham's North Central annual camp. This parchment was signed by Remy only.

    That is to say, I consider myself an active, organizationally-unattached 2nd degree black belt, with Remy Presas as my sole instructor in the art. I had considerable MA background prior to meeting up with Remy, so it was pretty fast and easy to pick up, as you probably understand.

    Over the years I've read about you, and some interview(s), and am impressed with what you seem to be doing. Hope to have the opportunity to train with you sometime.

    I'd like to ask two short favors: (1) Who are the three persons Remy named as master level, other than yourself, and (2) Also--what is the publication/date?

    Thank you and good luck!

    Randy Fey
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    .2
    here's the names of my students who have 1st degrees who tested with
    Professor Presas...@ the Florida camps
    Jerry Pinada
    Jody Mehlman-Florida
    John Ralston-Louisiana
    David Shor- Texas
    Tony Torre- Florida
    Dr David Mc Gee- West Virginia
    Michael Haack- Florida
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Bruce Chiu.. he's a 3rd or 4th.. now living in Virginia
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    W. Hock Hochheim
    2nd Degree Black
    Every test, every bit of training from Remy directly, in privates,
    semi-privates and seminars.
    1989 to 1996.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    M. Replogle
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    _________________
    Kelly S. Worden
    I am posting this info for the Modern Arnis people that do not cross over to the WMAC forum. This is not an attempt to gain more readers. This is just an attempt at sharing information that seems to be important to all Modern Arnis players. If you have information that would assist Datu Worden please email him personally or post it here on Martial Talk. com or http://uechi-ryu-temp.ath.cx/forums/...pic.php?t=8888

    Take care
    Bob

  14. #14
    Bob Hubbard's Avatar
    Bob Hubbard is offline



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    Hi Bob.
    No worries. Its a great project and I'm sure I'm not alone in saying we can't wait to see the complete lineage.
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  15. #15
    modarnis's Avatar
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    Connecticut Area Modern Arnis Blackbelts

    Lee Lowery 6th
    Brian Zawilinski 5th
    Tony Silverio 4th
    Wayne Tanguay 2nd
    Brett Salafia 2nd
    Paul Kisckum 1st
    Bill Boisvert 1st
    LeeAnne Brophy 1st
    Lizz D'Atri (Bradstreet) 1st
    Jan Sternberg (Deceased) 1st

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